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Talk:Tal Celes
Bajoran Name Sorry about that, I just figured with her friend Billy calling her Tal and the officers refering to her as crewman Celes we would follow the rules of Bajoran naming layed out in TNG/DS9. Celes being the sirname and Tal being the given name, it would therefore be writen Celes Tal. Tyrant 15:54, 17 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant :She is credited as "Tal Celes", therefore that is the name we use. -- Michael Warren | ''Talk'' 15:56, Jan 17, 2005 (CET) How about a comment at the bottom of the page addressing the discrepancy? Tyrant 16:15, 17 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant :Is her name written out like that in episode credits? Otherwise, I don't see how we could accord the Encyclopedia or STARTREK.com ( your probable source for this credit ) more credence than actual dialogue? -- Captain Mike K. Bartel 16:16, 17 Jan 2005 (CET) This was not a matter of canon debate really, I was not trying to give more credit to anything else, and I didn't get the info from startrek.com, I just thought that the fact that her name seems to break from all other Bajoran names to date seemed worth mention. Tyrant 16:27, 17 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant :I'm questioning DarkHorizon: where is she credited as Tal Celes?: That might make a difference is how we interpret the credit. -- Captain Mike K. Bartel 16:29, 17 Jan 2005 (CET) ::Eh? It comes from StarTrek.com, also TVTome.com, and IMDB.com. Since StarTrek.com lists the episode credits as they are seen in the end titles, I see no reason to doubt it. -- Michael Warren | ''Talk'' 16:43, Jan 17, 2005 (CET) :::As far as I am concerned, if the argument "her named was listed as 'Tal Ceres' in the end credits, so that must be right" is justified in this episode, then the same argument is justified in Star Trek 6, and we should really be calling her "Uhuru" instead of "Uhura". End credits have been wrong before, and if the end credits are the only thing that disagrees with the well established Bajoran naming convention (I can name at least half a dozen Bajoran characters who support the family name first convention), then we should simply disregard it. And in any case, we've got no onscreen evidence to support that she prefers her name in anything but the Bajoran configuration.--Tiberius 11:07, 28 March 2007 (UTC) It's not a matter of credit, it's a matter of dialog, she is Bajoran, so based on their established naming style, if her name was Tal Celes her friend would have been calling her by her sirname and her superior officers would have been addressing her by her first name, until Janeway got comfortable with her and started calling her by her last name. You see the oddity of this? Tyrant 16:33, 17 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant :Heh, sorry misread on my part, thought you were talking to me. And for the record I am not looking to have the part moved, just thought it was worthy of a comment on the bottom of the page. Tyrant 16:35, 17 Jan 2005 (CET)Tyrant :Yes, I do think it's worthy of a comment - I think it's likely that the Voyager scriptwriters just forgot about the Bajoran name order. -- Michael Warren | ''Talk'' 16:43, Jan 17, 2005 (CET) ::Well, we've disregarded STARTREK.com before -- and her name was probably never arranged "Tal Celes" anywhere on screen, right (since traditionally VOY didnt put each acotrs name with a character name in the beginning guest credits? Wondering why we have to slavishly honor this, if it never appeared writted or spoken onscreen? -- Captain Mike K. Bartel 16:46, 17 Jan 2005 (CET) Standard Information Should the general "she was on Voyager, so..." information be on here? I think it would make the page more complete. i.e.: "She was aboard voyager during (events of caretaker), and was beamed aboard the array" and the events of Endgame. (and so on and so on). -AJHalliwell 02:01, 23 May 2005 (UTC) * True... if anyone could think of a good way of wording it all, I'm all for it. My creative mind is offline today for some reason... AmdrBoltz 02:07, 23 May 2005 (UTC) * I really think that's being awfully redundant and perhaps being a little too deceptive; the character didn't exist in "Caretaker" and anyone curious about the details of Voyager's journey would be better off reading the article on the ship, which is wikilinked. We should just stick with the important facts from the appearances and references to the character. Otherwise, we can get really complex and start finding ways to link minor characters to any event whatsoever just because they may have been around, such as when Voyager's crew were stranded in "Basics" and "Displaced" or when they were affected by some malady like in "Macrocosm" or "Waking Moments." Also, I still believe that we should remove reference to "Endgame" for the same reasons, and for what I said on the featured nominations page; we don't know for certain whether or not she was alive at the end of the series. -- SmokeDetector47 // ''talk'' 19:47, 30 May 2005 (UTC) Moved from Nominations for featured articles *Tal Celes -- Great content for a minor character AmdrBoltz 01:51, 23 May 2005 (UTC) **Ah, this was an old article of mine. A lot of nice community work added since then, I certainly support. Tyrant 03:06, 23 May 2005 (UTC)Tyrant ** Support — THOR 03:29, 23 May 2005 (UTC) ** Support, with the condition that the "Caretaker" datapoint be removed (Tal wasn't mentioned or established that far back and the info about Voyager being lost can be condensed into a sentence in the opening paragraph) and the "Endgame" datapoint removed (we don't know 100% for sure she survived). -- SmokeDetector47 // ''talk'' 04:43, 30 May 2005 (UTC) **Please see the talk page regarding the addition of Caretaker and Endgame information. I orignaly didndt add it in, but it was said it should be added... AmdrBoltz 19:33, 30 May 2005 (UTC) Rewrite? I'm not too sure if this latest big rewrite By Eyes Only is any good. It gives a lot of excess information about really weird things. Like writing 'Operations Manger Harry Kim' instead of just Ensign Harry Kim, and a lot of other stuff too. Kim is never mentioned or referenced to in that fashion on MA as far as I know. Not to mention the fact that it seems to remove information in several places. Like the removal of the fact that she once struck Harry Kim by accident. Some of the rewrite is ok. It improves grammer and syntax but that could be done without all the other edits. Need I remind Eyes Only that this is already a featured article and that it therefore is not in need of a such complete rewrite. Marjolijn 1:32 December 9 2007 (CET) ::I would agree. I would also question calling Seven "Chief Astrometrician" when she was never addressed or referred to as such during the show. I don't think it is neccesary to add all the titles (or nonexistent titles) to every characters name.--31dot 00:39, 9 December 2007 (UTC)